2018 NHL1B Round 3 - Dublin v Limerick: Gaelic Grounds, Limerick, Sat 17 Feb


#181

Everyone keeps talking about the Cuala lads coming back but realistically that is not going to change things much as unless Con comes with them we are still not going to have any great goal scoring threat up-front.


#182


#183

Problems stemming from not winning puckouts…trying to stay positive but not a new problem…


#184

The stat about puck outs is exactly my point, how can any team expect to win a game when they cannot get a platform from their own puckouts. All it does is invite pressure right back on to you. Did anyone else notice O’Donnell’s body language, especially in the 2nd half, didn’t seem interested and was very lethargic… worrying - we need him at the top of his game.


#185

He played a full fitz match this week.


#186

Wouldn’t be as downbeat as most. Great respect for those giving their all for Dublin hurling. Expect a lot of tough days out and poor results before the green shoots of a great team start to emerge.
I’m sure we could put a team together that would keep us in 1b, but doubt it would be a team to challenge for an all Ireland.


#187

True, as did Burke and Whitely - who were also fairly anonymous in the 2nd half.
Disappointed not to se Macaffrey and Paul Ryan introduced


#188

Just back now from game. Long drive after a beating like that! That was absolutely dire, but there might be a strategy in there somewhere, just because it isn’t obvious- it doesn’t mean it’s not there.

I suspect only O Donnell, Nolan, Crummy, Barrett, Sutcliffe and maybe Keaney will be on the championship team from the 15 that started. Of everyone else, Connolly is probably next best.

Burke and Whitely are lovely hurlers, but just too light yet, they can’t put their man under pressure at all when he has the ball. They will come good, but they need a shed load of S&C work.

The diamond of centre back, midfield and centre forward were destroyed. Limerick had loads of space there to do what they want. The full back line was also eaten, but it’s hard to blame them totally as the ball came in so frequently.

The only player on the field actually I thought who was flat out giving it everything was Sutcliffe, I don’t think any of the rest worked hard enough. Actually I thought the management team weren’t totally switched on either. Burke was injured in the second half and it took a good 5 minutes before it was noticed, even though the maor camán was roaring at them. It was completely farcical.

Rushe to corner forward is possibly only to ease him back in. I saw the point of the experiment when Cunningham was playing him in the forwards, and there is a good theory behind it. But the guy just isn’t a good enough hurler for it. He is a force of nature as a centre back and he can overcome his short comiings with aggression. But that doesn’t work as a forward. Maybe they can put the hurling into him, but it will take time.

I think they all have the capacity to learn. I also think there has been a thorough enough trawl of players, although I am not sure it has unearthed anyone new, except maybe Connolly. I don’t know if the currrent strategy is about winning or not, I suspect it’s not. But if they don’t mind huge beatings it would be good to be told in advance so I don’t have to travel the country to watch shite hurling.

I wouldn’t panic yet, as above, I don’t think that will be the championship team. But I am not unworried by the situation either. We could actually lose to Laois and then we would be really set back 20 years.

If the championship continues in this vein, I.e. we lose every group game, then I think we put this down to an interesting experiment and move on. In my heart of hearts though,I think this is the bottom and we should start to move up from here.


#189

Being downbeat and having respect for the lads are not mutually exclusive. Lads are welcome to fantasise that this is Gilroy with the footballers all over again. When Gilroy took over the footballers we were in the top 4 teams in the country. Granted he got us to the summit, a phenomenal achievement. Were the 3rd best team at best in Leinster in this sport. And even that can be disputed after the hiding Offaly gave us. These are dark days. Any chance of even one of those shoots rearing it’s head earlier than predicted?


#190

There is a huge expectation on the hurlers in Dublin that is not only unfair but totally misguided. We are learning to walk and let’s see what happens. -5 away to Limerick on the handicap was just crazy and a licence to print money. People need to get real here …


#191

Hate to rain on the naysayers parade but Dublin intercounty hurling has been in the doldrums for the past 4 seasons. Management has inherited a mess.
The plan is to evaluate the best players available to the county ,at this moment, and see who sinks or swims.
Those that make the cut for championship will deserve to be there.
The cuala lads aren’t the knights in shining armour. They’ve been involved heavily the last 4 seasons as well,remember. They will improve the set up,no doubt,once the right lads are picked.
So what management has to do is give everyone a fair shake,see who puts themselves forward and only then can the real work begin. We don’t have the squad to compete at this stage.
When everyone is available,that’s when the serious stuff starts.
Lads looking for instant success with a skeleton squad are missing the point completely.
Lads bemoaning about players being played out of position are missing the point completely.
Why,because the modern county game takes players all over the field and a player has to have a better understanding of the difference between attacking and defending, or central play to wing play ,or linking play.if a defender is played in the forwards and his man clears 15 balls off him he’ll learn,1 his man will clean him out if the ball in is poor and 2. When a forward cant defend ,the backs are cut to shreds (as what happened tonight).an intelligent player would use an experience like this to improve his own game from his quality of ball out of defense to his defending. Likewise the same for a forward being given a run in the backs. If ball after ball was raining down upon them ,they’d know what it feels like and how horribly exposed you become when forwards don’t tackle. Its called education and its seriously beneficial.
3 league games into a 3 year plan with a skeleton squad after 4 years of serious disappointment and some lads on here are ranting.
Give it some time,get behind the set up and give it some mature reflection after 18 months.
Some of you should leave your egos at the door and act a bit more like grown ups. You’d give Russian facebook trolls a run for their money ,what with all the discord your spreading. #MDGA. GILLER2020.


#192

Well said !!!

It’s a mess n has been for years , the management team need time n lots of it


#193

U[quote=“Wifi, post:188, topic:3065, full:true”]
Just back now from game. Long drive after a beating like that! That was absolutely dire, but there might be a strategy in there somewhere, just because it isn’t obvious- it doesn’t mean it’s not there.

I suspect only O Donnell, Nolan, Crummy, Barrett, Sutcliffe and maybe Keaney will be on the championship team from the 15 that started. Of everyone else, Connolly is probably next best.

Burke and Whitely are lovely hurlers, but just too light yet, they can’t put their man under pressure at all when he has the ball. They will come good, but they need a shed load of S&C work.

The diamond of centre back, midfield and centre forward were destroyed. Limerick had loads of space there to do what they want. The full back line was also eaten, but it’s hard to blame them totally as the ball came in so frequently.

The only player on the field actually I thought who was flat out giving it everything was Sutcliffe, I don’t think any of the rest worked hard enough. Actually I thought the management team weren’t totally switched on either. Burke was injured in the second half and it took a good 5 minutes before it was noticed, even though the maor camán was roaring at them. It was completely farcical.

Rushe to corner forward is possibly only to ease him back in. I saw the point of the experiment when Cunningham was playing him in the forwards, and there is a good theory behind it. But the guy just isn’t a good enough hurler for it. He is a force of nature as a centre back and he can overcome his short comiings with aggression. But that doesn’t work as a forward. Maybe they can put the hurling into him, but it will take time.

I think they all have the capacity to learn. I also think there has been a thorough enough trawl of players, although I am not sure it has unearthed anyone new, except maybe Connolly. I don’t know if the currrent strategy is about winning or not, I suspect it’s not. But if they don’t mind huge beatings it would be good to be told in advance so I don’t have to travel the country to watch shite hurling.

I wouldn’t panic yet, as above, I don’t think that will be the championship team. But I am not unworried by the situation either. We could actually lose to Laois and then we would be really set back 20 years.

If the championship continues in this vein, I.e. we lose every group game, then I think we put this down to an interesting experiment and move on. In my heart of hearts though,I think this is the bottom and we should start to move up from here.
[/quote]

Danny picked off a few nice scores but his man Diarmaid Byrnes cleared a mountain of ball & scored 3 points himself.
Limerick outplayed us in every facet of the game, speed, movement, stick work (skill) & physicality. Some being young & inexperienced is no excuse as this Limerick team is younger than ours.
Truth is we’re not good enough, especially the team that went out last night. As some said above only 4/5 of the team that played last night are good enough. I’m afraid the lack of hurling knowledge, & in A. Cunningham’s case a lack of local hurling knowledge, is really starting to show. Under the likes of Mattie Kenny or even if the likes of Joe Fortune was involved, some of the players who are being persisted with at the moment wouldn’t even make the panel.
Hurling at the end of the day and at its core is a skill & intelligence based game & if you don’t have the skills or the hurling brain you won’t survive at Inter County level, if you do have them everything else can be worked on.
Our management have come from a football background where it’s possible to make huge strides with an average group by implementing top structures & training regimes. Footballers to a certain extent can be molded into the player you want them to be and average skilled footballers can be turned into effective Inter County players through hard work & discipline. It’s just not really possible in hurling, in a way it’s a case of you either have it or you dont. For example the majority of Inter County hurlers can strike off both sides with nearly equal comfort. How many Inter County footballers can comfortably kick with both feet? You simply wouldn’t survive in Inter County Hurling without it whereas most Inter County footballers comfortably survive without it.
Also, our biggest failing over the last few years has been our forward play i.e. getting scores from play, especially goals. Hurling is such a nuanced sport that I don’t really know how the County Board felt a group of football men were going to have the understanding of the game to be creative enough to solve this.
Personally I think, even with injured players & Cuala lads back, we are in for a barron 3/4 years. There is light at the end of the tunnel though as there are some very good 16/17/18 year olds coming through who will hopefully kick on & make us competitive at the top level again.


#194

Strange setup in this league is that we’ll probably get well beaten by Galway but should beat Laois. And low and behold we’ll be then in 1/4 final against the division 1 winners -

Gilroy said in an interview that for this group he thinks it’s more about applying our training ground form to matches but it looks to me that any sort of success on the scoreboard this year will depend on how well some of the cuala guys gel back on the team/setup


#195

Discipline will be key in this. Laois have a great free taker in King - scored 15 points from placed balls against an ill-disciplined Antrim last night.


#196

Wouldn’t be so sure of beating Laois lads … the other thing that worries me is we could be relagated to the 2md tier in the champ that would be a disaster … people talking about the Cuala are we sure they will want to come back involved they are at it 2 years non stop now they might fancy a break … I support gilroy And I expected just a year of stailbility but we could be 2a and joe mcdonagh cup next year


#197

There is something seriously wrong within Dublin. Regardless of what Ger Cunningham did or didnt do, the players are lacking in the basic fundamentals. You have to look deeper at the type of player being produced within the county and where they are in comparison to other counties. Its one thing to lose, but getting hammered at this level is a real worry. Dublin will have their work cut out to beat Laois. Long hard road ahead that needs a closer look at beyond whatever particular mgt happens to be in place.


#198

At the moment , we’re ranked maybe 9th or 10th in the the country behind 5 Munster teams Galway Wexford Kilkenny. . The management team have targeted a consistent top 4 as their overall aim.


#199

Yeah, I am not so sure anymore. I can see the logic in trying out players, but they have played a mountain of games now since the start of the year and in reality the team isn’t changing that much.

We have loads to come back in and it will improve, but I am not so sure it should have went so bad. I wouldn’t panic yet though, but I would be getting a little nervous! The primary reason they got slaughtered last night is they didn’t work hard enough, that could be linked to the type of training they are doing or something.

They needed to flood midfield to deny Limerick space. At a minimum a corner forward should have went off and a third midfielder take his place. Coincidently like Rian McBride (who was sitting on the line) has been doing at college level.

I know they took over a team that was in a bad place, and they will have a plan, and they need to be brave and stick to it. But within any plan there needs to be room for adjustment and they didn’t adjust last night. Tactically Dublin got it very wrong, personnel wise they got some wrong (although we don’t know what options they actually have) and attitude wise the players (and management judging by their non reaction to the Burke thing) got it wrong.


#200

That was grim. Starting to get nervous now. I know they’re still giving lads chances for positions etc but way off the pace again. Way off it. Work rate. Ball winning. Basic execution. I know we’re missing x, y and zed but it’s getting worrying.

It’s one thing getting hammered by tipp, but bad beating off of Offaly and limerick is not good.