2019 NHL1B Round 4; Dublin v Waterford, Sunday February 24th, Parnell Park, 2pm


#1

So after a disappointing loss to Galway,next up is Waterford in an another difficult game

Waterford have put up huge scores,even though you would say they haven’t been tested

Hopefully a better performance than last Sunday


#2

Id still be giving them leeway as this is another start under a new manager trying to get his ideas over to a new group. All takes time but we have looked a step behind and don’t have that cleverness the “big 4/5” have and as a result we need to work a lot harder to create a scoring opportunity which has a knock on effect to the energy and spirit of the team.
Parnell is a decent ground for Dublin hurling teams and they generally perform well in its tight surround.


#3

Its round 4 i believe?

Bookies have Waterford at +2pts for this one. I’d find it hard to spit us apart as the results have been below what we’ve been expecting but I believe a factor is the college action that a lot of lads are taking part in.

Waterford have 6pts but you’d expect that after playing Carlow, Laois and Offaly.

The contrast between our backs and their roaming forwards will be interesting. Tight pitch will suit us more than them.


#4

But they were All Ireland finalists in 2017 and u21 A I the year before. They were dogged with injuries last year and crucial refereeing decisions went against them. They have a lot of real good young hurlers.
Still, it’s Parnell Park so hoping for a big performance from Dublin.
Was impressed with our full back line last week -ODonnell was immense and the Galway inside forwards didn’t do a whole lot of damage.When you consider Canning got 8 from frees, Mannion 4 from midfield and Harte 2 from wing back maybe our forwards aren’t all that bad after all.
McBride got 3 and if we had another midfielder to contribute similar + Crummey and Barret who are well capable of long range points, it would all help.


#5

They are not a bad side at all.Theyve put up some big scores,even the last day in wet conditions,hoping for a better performance this weekend and I think we’ll get that


#6

Very hard to know who we have available for this. I think Hetherton damaged his chances last week and possibly one of the forward spots they had pegged for him is up for grabs again (unless they had trained the legs off him the previous week, or there is some other back story).

I suspect the forwards might be something like Sutcliffe, Rushe, Treacy, Ryan, Dillon and Burke. With a big assumption in there that Ryan will be back. If Ryan isn’t back, I assume O Rourke will start. O Rourke is a serious hurler, but I just can’t see it working out long term with his size. Maybe with better forwards he could be the X factor one, but we don’t have that luxury at the moment. I would love to see Schutte or Winters get a run, but I have no idea where they are at. Hopefully Boland could be back too at midfield, it’s about six weeks since he went off injured.

All of that is based on who Kenny has had on match day squads. Left to my own devices I would be including one younger lad. We know now what each of our forward options brings more or less, and I think even with the very best six we can muster, one of them will be weakish - so finding one from outside the current ones being tried would be a game changer.

Maybe management aren’t putting any importance on this, in reality it means nothing. So we won’t really know how they are going until the championship (like last year).


#7

I think that might be the case for a while. The Gilroy plan seemed to be to get so fit that they could keep up the extra effort for the whole game.

@LiamMac posted stats here a few months ago that showed us up near the top in last years championship in all the ‘hard work’ ones. The blocking, hooking, turnovers, pass disruptions etc. We really need to be there again this year.


#8

I’ll be happy with massive increase in intensity and work rate for 70 mins. Wouldn’t be to worried about not getting the win once with do that! Consistency in this area is vital going forward into the championship!


#9

Oisin O Rourke needs that perfect ball into him where he’s one on one with his man in space. Unfortunately we haven’t been delivering the type of ball consistently enough that he needs. Is a pity as I doubt there’s many corner backs would fancy being isolated against him out in the corner in a 1 v 1. I agree his size counts against him


#10

Good point, the balls in to anyone on the ff line haven’t been great.

Is O Rourke fast though? I haven’t really seen enough of him to judge it.


#11

Wouldn’t say blistering pace but quick enough for the position anyway. Excellent first touch and turn and can score from the tight angles from what I’ve seen. Would be doing this regularly at club level. Again it’s when the corner back is as mobile he struggles to shake them off due to how light he is.


#12

Never played hurling , get to as many club/county games as I can take what I say with a pinch of salt , but do we not overly complicate hurling in Dublin when analyze in particular forward play , I’ve read recently, he’s not big enough , he can’t win his own ball , he’s not fast enough etc Dotsy showed us that height was not an impediment, nor was the perfect ball , he could street fight with the best and was as wristy as any , your not allways going to get great ball that’s a fact what’s also a fact is if you can’t win your own battle with your marker your at nothing, equally giving cheap frees away is not aggression it’s poor play , just my observation of Dublin games and some comments could just as easily be wrong


#13

Damo for me 2 things come into the equation of Dublin forward play…1) Movement and the timing of it and 2) Releasing the pass at the right time to benefit from any movement

At county I think we hit too many 50 50 balls to our forwards…Look hoe Limerick feed the full forwsrd line, run made ball goes to suit the run for the majority of the time


#14

Just a observation I’ve noticed at development squads a lot of defenders like to take a touch have a look around before hitting or run out of defence with ball before being forced to release, it’s like I worked hard to get it Jesus now I’ve to release it , or I’ve seen lads quite blankly refuse to play a simple pass it’s allways Hollywood, there’s a team ethic in giving the right ball to make your team mate look good as opposed to You looking good , if that gets engrained and not challenged when lads are young your going to struggle later on


#15

Would agree with you there. Tommie Walsh wasn’t the biggest of men but was brilliant in the air and also at winning his own ball. Cha Fitzpatrick likewise. And as you mentioned, Dotsy was always a great guy to win ball and use it well.


#16

Dotsy was a different player altogether than Oisin is though. Plenty of smaller lads have been greats. Joe Deane to name one. It’s oisins style of play that requires more strength and athleticism to be effective at inter county level. He has the touch, the strike and the accuracy.
In regards to forwards winning their own ball I agree, but if we just expect to lamp balls in on top of forwards and expect them to keep winning it and scoring then I’m afraid the team is at nothing. The good sides put the ball in that favours their forward line personnel.


#17

Are we restricting our ability to play quick ball into space for lads to run onto by playing in Parnell Park ie tighter pitch. It means that when we go to bigger pitches we’re not used to it .
Just watched the Limerick game again last night, lads pulled out wide and created space for each other to either run into to and open the game up.
Agree @Damothedub, very hard to get lads to buy into ‘Giving the ball to a better man in better position’ one reason for this is lads are trying to impress at Dev Squads to make the Team. Personally I’d pick a lad who can read a game and give intelligent ball over a lad who just wants to score all the time .


#18

Your point about the 50-50 ball is spot on. A few times v Galway we did this. Indeed a number of them were two Galway lads on our isolated forward. But still the ball is sent out to him! If there are two lads on this guy then surly we have one lad free? Need to take the right options. Or more exactly we need to be aware of these options.


#19

I am not sure of the mentality behind it, or if Dublin are worse then any other. But I think it’s common enough for a guy to be coming out with the ball and his body shape, and how he is holding the ball, is all set up to give it off to his right (for example). He holds up waiting for something to happen there, and it doesn’t, but he gives the ball anyway. He isn’t mentally prepared to switch from his original plan.

Also, and this is a Dublin thing, I have seen where a guy is soling out, holding the hurl in his right hand. He has a player totally free on his left (which is a difficult hand pass) and a 50/50 on his right - but he gives the ball to the right because he can.

But it is hard to judge in particular with Dublin, because up until last Sunday they did mainly the right things. I think the difference on Sunday was that the forwards were being marked by guys who were at least as athletic as them. So they couldn’t out sprint or out muscle them. I guess that is why Rushe keeps getting picked in there, because he can out muscle guys.

I think we have to pick guys who can get on their own ball as a first requirement. That’s why I am not sure about Burke. But he is so good at getting scores he might be an exception, but I mean ‘might’. Again, I don’t know why Eoghan Conroy isn’t included who can get his own ball. You need to be fast, strong or good in the air - preferably all three.

But I also Dublin players just need to work harder. If there isn’t a forward getting free, someone needs to be running in support to take on the ball. McBrkde does it, Sutcliffe does it; David Treacy actually does it - but a lot of others don’t.

Just on Dotsy, mentioned above, there were days it didn’t happen for him. Daly didn’t always pick him. But corner forward is very difficult. But Dotsy has power, pace and touch. If a corner forward hasn’t at least two of those, he probably shouldn’t be there. Being nisley tricky on the ball isn’t enough, if you never have it.


#20

Would agree with you there @Bluedub

Much higher intensity needed,we will definitely have a chance if we bring it